But Where in Ireland? Answer Buried in Records

In 2018 I traveled to Belgium to attend a friend's wedding. Afterwards, my cousin Peter and I spend 10 days driving around Ireland and Northern Ireland. Peter and I share Irish ancestors but we also have Irish ancestors on other branches of our separate family trees.

I loved Ireland. I especially loved the natural beauty of Northern Ireland. Being there did somehow make me feel closer to my Irish ancestors even though, like many Americans with Irish ancestry, I don't know exactly where most of my Irish ancestors were from. Once most immigrants arrived in the U.S. they didn't identify themselves by the town they came from, just the country.

On my paternal grandmother's side I know my great-great grandmother, Annette Hinch-Henry came from Barnamelia and Hackettstown, in County Wicklow. Also on dad's side, I know my Hughes came from Liscolman, Clonmore, again, in County Wicklow and my Grays came from County Cavan. 

My mom's side is more elusive and they suffer from very common Irish surnames; Joyce, Kelley, O'Neill, and Fay. Their U.S. records just record their place of birth as Ireland. No towns, no counties, just Ireland. Even if I may not have been in my ancestors' exact footsteps, I felt very at home in Ireland.

Years later, in 2021, suffering from the wanderlust caused by the Covid-19 world health crisis, I set about visiting the graves of my direct ancestors in this sort of cemetery marathon on which I dragged my cousin Peter. Actually for one cemetery visit I dragged both Cousin Peter and Cousin Ashlee all the way to Dayton, Ohio. I wrote about that adventure in this blog post: https://diggingupthedirtonmydeadpeople.blogspot.com/2021/06/third-great-grandpa-john-joyce-dayton.html 

Prior to that visit to the grave of my third great grandfather, John A. Joyce, I ordered his military pension file from the National Archives and Records Administration (NARA) in Washington D.C. In fact, I ordered the file on April 22, 2021. I made that trip to Dayton in June 2021. In November 2021 I finally received John's file; a 89 page pdf related to his military service as a First Class Boy in the U.S. Navy during the Mexican-American War. It took more than 6 months to obtain the file.

Now if you are like me, you don't know much about the Mexican-American War; but you see that word Navy and you feel all queasy - sea sickness sets in, right? It does for me. I have so many seafaring souls in my gene pool but any body of water makes me a little green. Ugh, I can't with the boats, people!

Anyway, John was in the Navy. He enlisted January 19, 1846. 1846!! His whole military service was a surprise to me really but I did not expect him to be in the U.S. before the potato famine.

Ireland suffered the famine between 1845 and 1852. It was a period of starvation, disease, death, and immense emigration. The poor were leaving Ireland in droves for America where they had the hope of not starving to death. Often Americans refer to their Irish immigrants who came during that period as Famine Irish. John enlisting in U.S. Navy in January 1846, that was pretty early on in the Great Famine, so it's likely my Joyces were pre-Famine Irish immigrants; that they arrived in the U.S. before 1845. 

Another great surprise is that John enlisted in the Navy in Philadelphia, PA. Philadelphia! My people are all New Yorkers. Philadelphia? Really? So this has put me on the path of searching for John, and perhaps his parents, yet unknown to me, immigrating through Philadelphia rather than New York. We'll see if I can find anything now that I have that lead.

The most amazing discovery in John's pension file, though, was the name of the county in Ireland where he was born. Yup! On page 24 of the 89 page pdf, at the bottom of the page it states "...born at ___, in the County of Armath, and State of Ireland..." Now Armath has to be County Armagh because there is no Armath. 

County Armagh is one of the six counties of Northern Ireland and one of the traditional thirty-two counties of Ireland. I don't think Peter and I drove through Armagh though. The closest we would have gotten would probably have been Banbridge on route between Belfast and Dublin. Guess I gotta go back!

52 Ancestors Challenge Week 23: "Mistake" - 3rd great grandparents, Lawrence & Bridget Fay

For awhile I had a cousin who lived in Saugeries, New York. Around the same time she lived there, I discovered that my maternal grandmother's family lived in Saugerties from the mid-to-late 1800s. It was a bit of surprise to me really. My maternal grandmother died before I was born. Thus, I have little family lore regarding this branch of my family. I think of them as my Irish immigrants who settled in New York City, though. But oh contraire mon frère. 

My 3rd great grandfather, Lawrence Fay (About 1829 - December 23, 1879), settled in Saugerties, Ulster County, New York, probably in the 1840s. He may have been a pre-famine Irish immigrant. I'm not sure as I have not been able to confirm his immigration date or where in Ireland he was born. 

The Great Famine occurred in Ireland between 1845 and 1852. During that time more than 1 million Irish died of starvation caused by phytophthora infestans, the fungus that invaded the potato plant; a staple of the Irish diet.

Lawrence was absolutely living in Saugerties at the time of the 1850 U.S. Federal Census. Pre-children, here Lawrence is listed with his wife, Bridget, living with a group of people that I don't know as being related.

The couple had 7 children. The oldest of which was my great great grandfather, Michael Fay (October 1852 - January 13, 1915).

I can't find much about Lawrence and Bridget's lives in Saugerties but I did find Lawrence listed in the 1880 Mortality Census, meaning he died before May 31, 1880.

If you find a relative in a Mortality Schedule you get so much information.

I have underlined my Lawrence in red but will transcribe the information as well below.

Fay, Lawrence. 
Age: 60. 
Sex: Male. 
Race: White. 

Marital Status: Married. 

Birthplace: Ireland. 

Father's birthplace: Ireland. 

Mother's birthplace: Ireland. 

Occupation: Blacksmith

Month in which the person died: December. 
Cause of Death: Chronic Bright's. 
How long a resident of the county?: 1
Place of Death: 445 W 40
Attending Physician: H.D. Joy

This information led me to a death certificate for Lawrence in the City of New York, not in Saugerties. However, his Manhattan death certificate indicates he is buried in Saugerties. In the red circle below I think it says Saugerties Ulster Co. He died on December 23, 1879 and was buried on Christmas Day. I didn't think Catholics buried on Christmas Day but the certificate says buried 25 Dec.

This find prompted me to look for his wife's, Bridget's, death certificate in the City of New York. She too is buried in Saugerties. She died on March 3, 1892.

Okay so we got this right? 

Lawrence Fay, age 60, died December 23, 1879.

Bridget Fay, age 60, died March 3, 1892.

Lookie here though. Their headstone at St. Mary of the Snows Roman Catholic Church in Saugerties, New York. That says Lawrence Fay Died 1880 aged 65 yrs Bridget Fay Died 1890 aged 60 yrs.

Mistakes were made people. Mistakes were made.

How these mistake were made I am not sure. I figure someone loved them enough to put up a stone long after this couple died and just gave the stone carver whatever information they thought they knew. Still...its a gesture of love and I am grateful there is a marker there, even if it isn't accurate.

52 Ancestors Challenge Week 5: "Branching Out" - Great-great grandparents Michael & Agnes Fay

For the last few years I have been working a lot with genetic genealogy. Mainly helping people find their biological parent or parents. In the summer of 2020 I decided I would dive more deeply into my own AncestryDNA results. My goal was to place 100 of my matches into my family tree. In order to do that, I most certainly had to expand my family tree; branch out as it were. I'll explain a little bit about how I did that.

Last week, though, I received an Ancestry message from a DNA match suggesting we might be 2nd or 3rd cousins based on what AncestryDNA suggested. Well, I already had built Cousin Lori in my tree and was able to quickly say, "Oh, we're 2nd cousins once removed on my mother's side." I Love it!

Ideally, Step 1: Make a fleshy tree! 

I really think it is best to do your DNA testing after you have developed a really fleshed out family tree. Get back at least to a few great-great grandparents and expand the tree by including everything you can find on your direct ancestors' siblings and their offspring. Make a fleshy tree!

I do realize though that it is not always the order in which genetic genealogy research comes into play. For example, I had a friend who had a good fleshy tree. He took an AncestryDNA test and linked it to his tree. And oddly, none of his matches popped up in ThruLines. 

ThruLines is a feature of AncestryDNA that shows you how you may be related to your DNA matches. It is based on information from your DNA matches' family trees. Now if you have been doing genealogy research for sometime you know how shitty some family trees can be. Lots of "researchers" just copy information from other people's trees without vetting the information themselves and backing it up with documentation. In short, you can't trust ThruLines. It might not place your DNA matches in the right place - - BUT once you link your DNA to your tree, ThruLines should recognize some of your direct ancestors in the trees (even shitty trees) of some of your DNA matches. For my friend it did not.

I had to break it to him that he was adopted. 48 years-old and the thought never crossed his mind. That is when genetic genealogy comes to play a bigger role. For most of us though, we aren't adopted and our fathers are our biological fathers. Thus, once you link your AncestryDNA results to your fleshy tree, ThruLines will show how some of your matches may be connected to you. If it doesn't, hate to break it to you but you're probably adopted or you have some bad research going on in your tree.

I generally, I did not use ThruLines to get my 100 matches in my tree though.

Step 2: Look at your match list.

That ethnicity pie chart is junk science if you ask me. It's interesting, sure, but it's not going to tell you who your great-great-great grandparents were or where they lived. I wish people would stop caring about estimates so much. Sure busted fender, need a kitchen remodeled, want to know how long the wait will be for dinner, go get all the estimates you want. Genealogy isn't an estimate.

And ThruLines I already discussed. 

You want to figure out who you have in common with each of your matches!

I am fortunate to have a lot of known family members who have tested through AncestryDNA. Let me count... 43! 43 of my DNA matches on Ancestry are people that I have either spoken to face-to-face in-person during my lifetime or conducted online genealogy research with and expected to see in my DNA results. That's a lot. Then again though, it is a big family.

When you open your match list, Ancestry now asks you if you know the person. You want to fill that out if you can.

Step 3: Link the known family members into your tree!

You should know almost everyone in the following groups: Parent/Child, Full Siblings, and Close Family. 

Towards the bottom of the Close Family group there might be a few people you don't know; typically some cousins of your parents or some second cousins wind up there. Second cousins are people with whom you have the same great grandparents in common. A majority of your Parent/Child, Full Siblings, and Close Family should already be in your fleshy tree. If not, maybe your tree isn't really that fleshy. Go flesh it up! Or maybe we need to have that heart-to-heart.

When you click on the name of a match in the list, it opens their DNA profile.

Next to their name you'll see a symbol which to me looks like the face of the Man in the Moon; a circle with a little pedigree shaped Y and a plus sign. Like this: 

Right? Looks like the Man in the Moon's face, doesn't it? Well, that is what I see. Anyway...

Once you click on that, a panel will open to the right and you can search for the person in your tree. If they are in your tree, it will link the match to the tree. 

Done!

Wait! What about the other 57 people that I worked into my tree that I didn't know in real life??

Well - - - 

This is when the work starts!

Step 4: Look at their linked and unlinked trees.

Sometimes Ancestry will show you that you and your match have a common ancestor in your respective trees. That will look like this:

Examine their trees. Build their line down into your tree from the ancestor you have in common down to the person you match to. Making sure you review their connected documents, etc. Build them right in. THEN you can use that "Man in the Moon"-tool and connect that match to your tree.

That technique added about another 30 linked DNA matches.

The remaining 27 to 30, you ask. Well about a dozen or so had unlinked trees that or "unavailable" trees. It took a few more clicks then to open their trees and look around for our possible common ancestors.

The additional dozen required much more work to link them to my tree. I had to apply the Leeds Method, look at what shared matches we had, email some of them, snoop for them on social media, etc. I used a bunch of techniques but you can do this. YES you can!

AGAIN, Branch out! 

Explore the siblings of your direct ancestors through documentation. Add them into your tree.

So, when my 2nd cousins once removed on my mother's side reached out to me because we had a DNA match - - remember her, back in paragraph 2 - - Cousin Lori - - she was already in my tree because I "branched out." 

Based on her Ancestry tree, which was not linked to her DNA, I could see exactly who we had in common; Michael Fay (October 1852-  13 January 1915) & Agnes Joyce-Fay (12 August 1865 - 12 December 1933), my great-great grandparents.

The Family of Michael & Agnes Fay

Michael Fay, my great great grandfather, was born in Saugerties, New York in October 1852 to Lawrence Fay and Bridget Kelly (or Kelley)-Fay who were both born in Ireland. Based on census records and records from St. Mary of the Snows Roman Catholic Church in Saugerties, New York, I believe that Lawrence and Bridget had 7 other children after Michael from about 1854 to 1869: Thomas, James, John, Martha, Joseph, Anne, and Lawrence J.

Agnes Joyce-Fay, Michael's wife and my great great grandmother, was the daughter of John Aloysius Joyce (11 February 1829 - 30 September 1910) and Mary Ann O’Neil-Joyce (about 1829 - 11 January 1911), again, both of whom were born in Ireland. Agnes was the youngest of their five Joyce children. Her four older siblings were named James, John, Mary, and Gertrude; all born between 1854 and 1863. 

Michael and Agnes Joyce-Fay had six children of their own: Leo (28 January 1888 – 27 January 1819), Anna (3 February 1889 – 5 February 1819), James (my great grandfather - 11 February 1893 - 1 October 1964), Mary Ann (17 June 1897 – 1965), George (7 October 1898 – 6 April 1976), and Agnes (April 1900 – unknown). 

This is what I mean by "branching out" and making a "fleshy tree". I had all these siblings in my tree when Cousin Lori contacted me. I descend from Michael and Agnes's son, James. Cousin Lori descends from their son George. I had already had documents attached to George including his marriage record and census records identifying his children. Years before I had already communicated with other cousins from this line. So although I don't "know" Cousin Lori, she was already in my tree thanks to that DNA match and good old fashion genealogy research through documentation.

Lawrence Fay in the 1880 U.S. Census Mortality Schedule

I have developed a personal catalog of all my genealogy documentation. Recently, I have been working through all the census records in my collection; making sure I have produced a transcript for each one. By the way, one can find many blank U.S. Census forms available online to help with transcription.

Then I came across my copy of the 1880 U.S. Census Mortality Schedule listing my 3rd great-grandfather, Lawrence Fay. These Census Schedules are unlike the regular U.S. Census records. The U.S. Census Mortality Schedules list individuals who died in the preceding year; not the calendar year, mind you, but a census year. If the 1880 census started on June 1, the schedule list deaths from June 1, 1879 through May 31, 1880. I learned that fact this morning by reading a posted by Michael J. Leclerc on the Mocavo blog.

I found this Mortality Schedule by doing one of those broad sweeping, Hail-Mary type of searches in Ancestry.com. That's what I call a search when I am at my whits-end  and hoping to find anything I can by just searching for a last name; in this case, Fay. Sometimes I have success trying to see everything a database might have but most of the time that type of search results in too many hits and is just too overwhelming. I don't really recommend it but in this case I found a record I might not otherwise have found because he was indexed as Laramie Fay. Although, the record clearly looks like "Lawrense" to me.

These schedules provide the name of the deceased, age, sex, race, marital status, place of birth, parents' place of birth, occupation, month of death, how long a resident of the county, address at which he/she died, and attending physician.

At the time I found this record, I knew Lawrence Fay was buried in Saugerties, NY at the cemetery of St. Mary of the Snows Roman Catholic Church. I didn't know for sure where Lawrence died, though. I had found his wife, Bridget, and their children in a curious 1880 census record in which Lawrence's name is listed but then crossed out. I didn't know if he died in New York City or Saugerties.

Here is a detail from the 1880 U.S. Federal Census record I have for Bridget Fay and her children:

She was living on 44th St. in Mahnattan between 9th and 10th Avenue in 1880. See those Kellys listed between the two halves of the Fay entry?? Well, I have information that indicates Bridget's maiden name to have been Kelly. This record has me wondering if the Kellys living in the same building as the Fays in 1880 were perhaps Bridget's sisters or cousins of some degree. Maybe Larry & Bridget moved from Saugerties to Manhattan to be near her family because he was sick with Bright's Disease; an obsolete classification for nephritis, a kidney condition.

This 1880 census record has put me on a hunt for the Kellys but the other 1880 record, the Mortality Schedule, clarified for me why Lawrence's name was crossed out and helped me determine a date of death for him.  Lawrence's death certificate, which is held by the New York City Municipal Archives, indicates that he died on December 23,1879 and was buried on Christmas Day in Saugerties. What a very sad Christmas that must have been and what a very important record the 1880 Mortality Schedule proved to be.